Richie Bostock: If anything, it's going to bring just so much more attention to people, just people realising the power of their breath. It's something that we do, it varies, you know, it's between 19 to 27,000 times a day is usually the range. And if you did anything else that many times a day, you'd probably have a pretty good idea of how and why you do it. But our breathing's kind of been swept under the rug a little bit as something that just happens. Yet, cultures that have been around for centuries have been using it for all sorts of different reasons and we've decided that it's not important.
Dr Rupy: This is a special bonus episode that I'm doing with returning guest on the show, Richie Bostock, also known as The Breath Guy. Now, me and Richie sat down over a year ago now, talking about his work as a breathwork coach, an author now, a speaker, and his mission to spread the life-changing possibilities of breathwork to the world. He's an incredible, inspirational character and I love his work and his new book called Exhale is wonderful. It's a real simple guide for people who have either never heard of breathwork or are experienced in breathwork and want to learn more. It dives into the science behind breathwork, how to get started and the different exercises for different outcomes. It's brilliant and I've personally had experiences of the incredible effects of this method in a number of different training sessions. He's really, really good at his craft and being able to write a book on the subject is fantastic. We've talked about breathwork in the podcast that I did with him, but we've also talked about it with neuro-gastroenterologist Dr Rabia in another podcast that we did specifically about breathing for your gut. Now, I just want to say that by simply learning how to use our breath as a tool, the way nature intended us to, can actually lead to dramatic changes. And this is something that Richie goes into a lot more depth in in his book. It's as simple as taking a few simple breaths. In this pod, we start off talking about the process of Richie writing his book, what you can expect from it, but we also do a small breath session right at the end that I think is wonderful. It's a focused breath session that has quite energetic breathing at the start and then slow, relaxed inhale and exhale at the end. I think you're going to really enjoy it, but again, as we say on the podcast, please only do the breathwork if you're at home in a relaxed position, you don't have any other issues, and certainly not in a swimming pool or in contact with water. So, without further ado, this is my bonus podcast episode with Richie, where we talk about his new book, Exhale, and we do a breathwork session.
Dr Rupy: I guess when you're in a position that you're in right now, and I am to to an extent, to maintain the brand and the sort of aesthetic that you've worked so hard to to build, it's it's a tough, it's it's harder to make that trade-off. So I think, yeah.
Richie Bostock: It was really funny on the Lauren's podcast and because I've been on a couple of these panels before of like how to build a wellness business and stuff. And I I can truly say hand on my heart that so much of what has happened for me has just been so organic and very little me thinking strategically about things and stuff just kind of happening. So I was thinking about when I was about to go on the podcast, I'm like, I wonder how many ways, different ways I can say it just happened. Like how many different words and cinemas can I use because a lot of what I feel like has happened for me has just kind of been that way. And for a while, I didn't feel like I could add anything or give advice, but now when I really look back retrospectively, I I think I do and I see like why things felt like they just happened. But actually it was because of one decision that I made, which was, so for breathwork, breathe as many people as possible. That was like the, that was the my strategy. That was as much as it was like just any opportunity, any opportunity you get, yes, and go and show it and and that's enough. And it ended up being kind of that way. So there was a lot of like doing stuff for free and a lot of like just, you know, even, you know, needing to catch Ubers across, you know, to to East London just to do someone for free. So it cost you like, you know, 60 quid to be able to give a free session, but just trusting your gut that actually like I need to do this, I need to show it to this person and yeah, like, it was good, it was a good podcast.
Dr Rupy: It's getting that experience, you know. Like I remember vividly the first event that I did back in 2015, obviously for free. And the experiences and you know, the what you learn from the questions and the crowd and getting to know the community and you know, where people's pain points are and then you figure things out once you speak to your users, your consumers, whatever you want to call them, your community. So yeah, no, it's really interesting to to sort of see that journey in you that's mirrored. And and I just had a flashback now of the first time we connected was on my podcast a couple of years ago now, dude. And it was, it doesn't exist anymore. But it was so good to meet you and like you were everything that I envisaged in terms of like how grounded you were, how positive you were, you know, obviously you're Aussie, so you've already got that natural.
Richie Bostock: Comes with the territory, right?
Dr Rupy: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And now, you know, you've written your book. It's amazing. You have your app out.
Richie Bostock: Yeah, a lot's happened. You know, we were talking, we were talking about the app, weren't we back then? So like, yeah, I guess a lot has happened since then and, you know, I feel, I guess very lucky and fortunate to be in the position that I'm in that, you know, things have started to go the way it has. And and with that comes like a, and I'm sure you feel this as well, you know, a tremendous sense of responsibility, you know, like when you feel like you have something that can help people and you you want to just share it with as many people as possible. It's like you just get really excited. You go like, I here we go, like I want to give this to you and hopefully it can help you in your life. You know, talking about just showing up all the time and just making that decision of I just want to breathe people, breathe people, breathe people. The very first festival I did was Balance Festival in London. And I was with a gym at the time and they had like a set space. So they were just doing running classes the entire time. And the class was kind of like, do sort of like a hit workout and then breathing afterwards or some sort of they wanted to do any kind of meditation or mindfulness, but practice. But it ended up just being me doing every single class and doing breathwork, which meant that across the three days of the festival, I taught 26 classes. But again, was just like absolutely delirious by the end of it, but so excited and so happy to be able to see people, to reach people, to share the work that I'm genuinely so passionate about. But and there was a there was a rosemary water stand right next to where we were at. And this was, I don't know if it even exists anymore, but yeah, we I became best friends with the promo girl who was handing out the rosemary water. So I think I averaged like 16 waters a day or something like that from all the talking and yeah, so it was it was a wild time. And things have moved quite a bit for everybody, I think.
Dr Rupy: Absolutely, yeah. I mean, the last time we spoke was when you were doing your session in Hammersmith with Ben and a few other people. It was my first ice cold water bath.
Richie Bostock: How'd you find it?
Dr Rupy: It was amazing, actually. I was very skeptical of it before because I just thought, you know what, I'm not going to be able to deal with this. And it was two minutes, I think it was. And luckily, the guy who was, if anyone listening to this who doesn't know what an ice water bath is, it's basically literally what it says on the tin. You go into a big paddling pool, yeah, above ground pool, basically. It's quite big. It's probably about waist high and they fill it with ice and water.
Richie Bostock: A ton, one ton of ice.
Dr Rupy: One ton of ice.
Richie Bostock: And a little bit of water just to mush it all together.
Dr Rupy: Just to mush it all together so you can actually get into the thing. And luckily, when we came in, there's like, I think it was five or six of us sharing it at the same time. You go in and your immediate reaction is, what on earth am I doing in this ice cold water bath in the middle of, I think it was like November or something like that. It was a cold day as well. But luckily, I had the guided meditation teacher just over my right ear, you know, just reminding us as to breathe, to, you know, work with it, don't fight the cold, accept the cold, surrender to it, all that kind of stuff. So luckily he was there and the two minutes flew by once I got into my sort of rhythm. And you know, it's really interesting to note some of the benefits of a number of different sports. One of them being outdoor swimming, cold water swimming, cycling, and the impact on adiposity, immune system benefits as well as cognitive benefits because for the rest of that day and perhaps the next day, I felt really, really refreshed. Really refreshed.
Richie Bostock: You know, there are, like you say, there are those very real physical benefits that anecdotally or even can be can be measured and and I think, you know, many people will will go into the ice bath or try and create some sort of routine of cold exposure for that reason. But I know for me and most of the people that I work with, the the the value of putting yourself in a position of physiological stress and having to work out a way to be able to find the calm or the peace or the being okay in that moment, that training is what really translates so incredibly into life because, you know, how much, you know, throughout the day does does stuff happen. We all live crazy fast-paced lives and and we're constantly being bombarded with information and different people and interacting with all sorts of different things and you know, we're going to be triggered emotionally all the time, just little things, whether consciously or unconsciously. And it is such a beautiful gift to be able to have to maybe have the body go into a state of stress because something just happened in your life. Maybe someone spoke to you a little bit too nastily or you stepped off the curb and nearly got hit by a cyclist or deliveroo rider going by or something. Oh my gosh. To have that momentary stress response, but have the training in your mind to be able to go, you know what, but I'm okay. And I'm fine. And what that means is that you start to break this loop of feeling some sort of emotion, whether it's stress or anxiety or panic or anger, and then thinking why you are feeling that, which then causes you to feel more of that as you release a whole new set of chemicals and hormones that create the feeling of emotion inside of you. And then it breaks the cycle of feeling and thinking, thinking and feeling and and round and round you go. So I find that people who are able to maintain like a a regular practice of cold exposure activity, they they develop a whole new relationship to stress where they become much more like unshakable. And and that in itself, purely just through that presence of mind means that it affects you physically because you start to, you know, be able to move out of any kind of stress responses that you might be chronically exhibiting or existing in all the time. Um, which obviously has so many great effects, right, physically for the body. Uh, you know, I have one person, I love you said wild swimming. I know one person who was really going through a tough time, terrible anxiety attacks and terrible panic attacks and it was, she will say that it's wild swimming that saved her, cold water swimming, and that it really it shifted her body's ability to be able to move between states of stress and states of relaxation. It's that you stress, right? It's that controlled moments of stress where that, you know, we're very used to when we exercise, but can you use things like cold water, even breathing, you know, because we can change the way our nervous system is firing through breathing as well. Um, as an exercise to be able to better prepare our mental states.
Dr Rupy: That's a lovely segue into breathing.
Richie Bostock: Are we here to talk about breathing? I don't know.
Dr Rupy: I love how we spent the the first part of this pod talking about ice water swimming when your book is obviously about breathing.
Richie Bostock: Yeah, yeah, there's a bit of breathing in my book. And I also talk a little bit about cold water as well in the book because that's obviously where it all started for me. But I'm really excited about the book coming out. You know, it's like, it's it's the book I wish that I first had when I started breathwork. So I in mind when I was writing this, always just had the version of me that knew nothing and was like, what were the main questions that I had? And the thing is, breathwork is such a big spectrum or or field of work and you can the breath is central to everything we do, which means you can use it in so many different ways. So I really was like, how can I create something that kind of paints the landscape of this is what the breath can do for you and therefore can be relevant to as many people as possible. Give, you know, the a taste of all the different ways that you can use the breath and then, you know, the direction for people to dive deeper in a specific subject if, you know, maybe athletic performance is their big thing that they want to focus on. Well, there's some stuff you can use for athletic performance in the book. Um, but, you know, there is links to how you can go deeper with the practice or if you're really wanting to work on your own personal development, how to use the breath as an incredible form of therapy. Well, there's ways to do it in the book and if you want to go deeper, check this out, you know. So it's kind of like, it's it's it's the book I that I would hope that people who are coming to this work for the first time can pick up and read and understand and go, oh, wow, I didn't know that my breathing was this important and could help me in so many different ways. Yeah. It's called Exhale, by the way, the book. I don't think I mentioned it. It's called Exhale.
Dr Rupy: I love that that the way you approach this book actually, because, you know, I think for certainly the first time we met and the first time I I came into sort of knowledge around breathwork and its benefits and the evidence base behind it, it was kind of this big, big world full of lots of claims, whether they be erroneous or whether they be evidence-based or not. And I think having a simple guide for how to use breath on a daily basis for the first time or even just becoming aware of the science behind it is such a useful guide for people, particularly now because it seems that breathwork in the short time period between our first podcast and now has become massive. Everyone's talking about mindfulness and breathing, 3-4-5 breathing, box breathing, all the different techniques that we've talked about and you've talked about in your book. But now it just seems to be in the mainstream consciousness.
Richie Bostock: And that's what's so exciting about it, I think is, you know, I think mindfulness has, you know, really come into its own in in the Western world, whether for good or for bad. I think there's, you know, a couple of different ways to look at it. Um, and meditation as well, obviously, has been around forever. Um, but I think a lot of people still struggle with those terms and those ideas. Um, because a lot of it, you know, is the mind trying to gain some sort of control on the mind. So it's like you're using the thing that you are struggling with in the first place to try and gain control over itself, which can be really tricky. And actually, you know, people ask me, do I meditate? Because why meditate when you can just do breathwork? Because breathwork tends to be quite a lot easier. But I I meditate every day because there is such a benefit to going through the struggle and the process of actually moving yourself into that meditative state. Like there's that process itself has so many learnings. Um, but breathwork is unique in that you're using the body to get a control and and affect the mind, which is so much easier and it just it means that any Joe blow off the street can come come, you know, can come in and do a session and breathe for a few minutes and feel something. Like guaranteed, it has to happen because of physiologically what's happening in the body. So it's so accessible and in many ways very easy to do. Um, and what's exciting is that it is becoming more evidence-based as more and more, uh, institutions and universities are looking to, uh, do more studies and understand really what's going on. Um, and there's some incredible people who have just purely dedicated themselves to breath who are really leading the charge in in in in understanding the real science of what happens. People like Brian McKenzie and, um, so they're brilliant and they're going to really help in in pushing this work. And, you know, at the same time, one of the most exciting ways that you can use breathwork is the part that's probably the least scientifically explored by this point. So, and I'm really am excited to see where that goes. Um, but, uh, you know, even in my book, I, you know, almost all the techniques that I share have, you know, studies backing them up and and and show and where it comes from. But then at the end, there is kind of the, uh, and here comes the woo woo because I have to still tell you this part because this is awesome. And really, it's mostly me telling stories and sharing my experiences of the various things that have happened for me during breathwork and the various things being like having out of body experiences, um, you know, having various relivings and and releasing and integrating of traumas that have happened in my life just by breathing. Um, being visited by Indian saints, you know, and and so these that's kind of the the part that a lot of people are going to go, that's interesting. But it's nice to just chuck it in there just as a, you know what, there's this is something an area where breathwork can take you. And if you're curious and you just want to give it a go, then who knows what would happen. But at the same time, it's, you know, it's really exciting that even what we call integrated breathwork, which is the very deeper styles of breathwork where we go into altered states of consciousness and and where you can have tremendous healing or spiritual experiencing, more and more people are really excited about what that is because that can really, really help humanity in a big and quick way. Uh, it's in the same way a lot of people are talking about things like, um, even psychedelic substances and you have, uh, organizations like MAPS and Imperial College Center for Psychedelic Research who are looking into the clinical, um, uses of various psychedelic substances and seeing tremendous results and going, wow, this is something that could be really special. Well, how cool would it be if you could have similar results but not have to take anything and just breathe? Um, it comes from you. It's very empowering, you know, to to think that you can heal yourself or, you know, have these different and interesting experiences just by doing something you do every day. Uh, is is pretty profound, I think, and is one of my favorite things that I like to teach people.
Dr Rupy: I appreciate the honesty. I think it's really important to be upfront about the anecdotes, um, because, you know, otherwise people are less forthcoming about their own experiences. Um, when actually there might be something to it. Um, it reminds me of a podcast I did with Jeffrey Rediger, who's a Harvard psychiatrist who spent most of his clinical career now studying spontaneous remission. And spontaneous remission of a whole bunch of different conditions, whether it be autoimmune, cancer, um, a whole bunch of of different conditions. And, you know, we in the medical profession, particularly are bad at, um, you know, discounting people's individual experiences as one-offs unless it fits the current paradigm. And in reality, the paradigms that we've been taught are quite, um, they're pretty rigid. They're not as malleable as they perhaps should be. I remember actually, um, to counter that point, when I first went to medical school, uh, a really distinguished professor on one of our first days in the first month, um, said to us, 50% of what you're going to learn during medical school is going to be found to be factually incorrect by the time you qualify. So just keep that open mind. And that was kind of systematically beaten out of me as I as I as I progressed through medicine. And I had to come around full circle when I had my own illnesses and and, you know, overcame it using a lifestyle medicine approach. So I I actually think it's really important to be open and honest about anecdotes in general, um, because you never know where it could lead scientific thinking. And unless we pay attention to things, we'll miss it.
Richie Bostock: I I I completely agree, you know, um, I have plenty of friends who, uh, either through their own, you know, sicknesses or helping others, maybe family or friends have started to look at alternative forms of healing and therapy and have had, you know, really fantastic results. And when they go to their traditional doctors and the doctors go, this is really good, like, what are you doing? And then I'm just thinking of one person right now in my mind. I think her response, she told me the story literally two days ago. Um, uh, so yeah, the doctors, what are you doing? And then she goes, I mean, I could tell you, but you're not going to like it. And then he goes, oh, no, please tell me because like I'm looking at what's happening. It's quite remarkable how quickly you've you've you've um, you've recovered. And she goes, yeah, well, I've been seeing this person and, you know, and been doing some energy healing and literally just went, oh, okay. And then of course, you know, the doctor goes, well, that's great, you know, keep doing what you're doing. It's working for you. And I have all the respect for anybody in the medical industry or the frontline practitioners. And one of the things I think of is like, you know, you you're seeing so many people, like I and I know what it's like to to see person after person and it takes a lot of energy. And you might have one of your patients come and explain something that seems remarkable and you can acknowledge it and be like, fantastic, but I kind of need to see the next patient now and you know, I need to save my brain space and my energy to be able to serve the next person at the best that I can. So it's like, sometimes I think it's almost unreasonable to expect frontline doctors to be like, you are amazing, tell me everything. I'm going to research every single thing that you tell me and. It's they you guys have a job and it's, you know, it's intense and but at the same time, you know, of course, it's nice to see what as as as everything as, you know, our evolution as as human beings and as a society continues, what new ways of looking at the body or looking at mental health, emotional health, you know, I I actually believe that things like energy work are going to become more mainstream and are going to as we develop the devices and practices to be able to measure what's going on, which do exist in places like Russia, but just haven't really gone to to the Western world yet. Um, Russian hospitals use devices to measure people's energy to see if, uh, they're ready to go and strong enough to take surgery, for example. So, you know, there's some interesting things out there. Um, but once I think the technology catches up where we can start to quantitatively measure things, then people will be like, wow. But at the same time, there are a lot of really cool, uh, studies and meta-analyses of, uh, various alternative treatments, I think. I think that if like Reiki, for example, is one of the most popular energy practices. And I think there's been a lot of studies now around what Reiki can do. Um, not for everybody, but obviously it can help a certain segment of the population. Um, and I do hope that happens for breathwork, you know, I've been speaking with some people for a while now about trying to get into a fMRI and do the breathing practices that we do and really measure what happens in the brain. Um, because I think if we see that, then that will spur a whole new curiosity and, um, hopefully some excitement around trying to research this more.
Dr Rupy: Yeah, I mean, I think we see that, um, to your point about fMRIs and stuff with, um, psychedelics like ayahuasca and and other substances, um, where they can actually see areas of the brain that are lighting up whilst people are on a trip and what that might translate into as to why people are having hallucinogenic effects, um, erasing or revisiting memories, all all those different sort of aspects of it. And then, but I think, um, with like energy healing, Reiki, all those other things, they suffer from the same issues with nutritional medicine in that the current methods of scientific study aren't really suited for those, um, modes of of intervention. It's very hard to blind. Um, it's very hard to, you know, accurately measure someone's dietary history at the moment. We haven't cracked that. Um, but there are some interesting, uh, avenues into alternative methods or complementary methods, I should say, to a whole bunch of different things. Actually, I was sent by a good friend of mine, um, actually one of my best friends who's a gastroenterologist, uh, almost a consultant now, and, um, it was a study looking at sham acupuncture versus genuine acupuncture and the statistical, uh, significance of the impact of the genuine acupuncture. So it wasn't just the, and that's a prime example of a good way of being able to distinguish between what might be placebo effect versus an an intended benefit of an actual procedure. Um, so it wasn't just because someone gave you attention and stuck needles in you, there was something in the way the needles were placed in a genuine, um, method. I don't know that much about Chinese medicine, but, uh, there was definitely a method to the acupuncture itself that had an impact on the gastrointestinal disease being.
Richie Bostock: So there was a statistically significant difference between.
Dr Rupy: There was definitely an improvement, yeah. And there was a multi-center study as well. I need to dig it out. He sent it to me. There weren't too many, um, individuals involved. And again, this is the issue because of cost and, you know, the the the impact. But when you when you're looking at low, relatively low cost interventions compared to, I don't know, disease modifying, uh, agents that we use routinely in the NHS and other healthcare systems, we definitely need to entertain more of those because, um, it's low cost, most of them are safe and potentially effective. So, yeah, as as is breathwork.
Richie Bostock: Yeah, as is as breathwork. I mean, here's the cool thing about it, right? It's it's as soon as you learn the technique, then you have something for with you for life that won't cost you a penny until they start taxing air. So, which, you know, who knows, maybe it will happen one day. But that's that's what's beautiful is, you know, it is it is a free technology once you learn how to use it. It's like, you know, we we didn't ever get the instruction manual on how to use our breath. So it's almost like inside of each and every one of us, we have like, uh, this Swiss army knife that we can use for all sorts of different reasons, but no one got taught how to open up the different bits and pieces of the knife. So, yeah.
Dr Rupy: Well, actually, on that point, what why don't you walk us through Exhale and and the the book and and you know, how you guide people on that on that journey that you wish you had and and how people can actually get started.
Richie Bostock: So, the book covers a few different areas. Um, it starts off with actually understanding the science of your breath and how it affects you. And it gives you a way to be able to observe and almost analyze your own breathing to see if it is actually in a way that is, you know, serving you, whether it's physically, mentally, and even emotionally. Um, so there's almost there's like a step-by-step guide on how to actually look and observe your breath. You have to actually record yourself breathing and and and look back and watch back and a way to be able to go, okay, this is happening, this is happening, this is happening. Therefore, I am a this kind of breather. So you almost get to put a little bit of a a classification on where you're at. And then there's a bespoke program, there's a 21-day, uh, breathe right program that based off what you are and where you're at with the various different types of aspects we look at your breathing, uh, how to be able to correct it. So it involves things like stretches, it involves things like foam rolling, it involves, um, different breathing exercises and even breath holding exercises. So you create like this little 20-minute custom plan that you can do daily for 21 days and that will just take you strides towards, um, optimizing your breath. And then, much like in your books, there's a bit of a a cookbook of breathing techniques on all these different ways that you can use the breath. Um, so, you know, we cover the very obvious ones like sleep, uh, stress and anxiety, panic attacks, um, nervousness, creating energy, but then there's some less obvious ones like how to make better decisions, how to use it to increase creativity or how to focus, um, how to have better sex, how to quit smoking, you know, there's and then things like for asthma, for autoimmune diseases, for high blood pressure. So it really paints a picture of all the different ways that you can use breath. There's even one for road rage on there. You know, like and very relevant in London these days, I'm telling you. Although the traffic's back and people are going insane on this, I swear. Anyway, but like, um, but yeah, so, so there's I feel like I wanted to create something where, uh, there'll be something that's useful for everybody, but also it's useful just to have it around for just in case something that pops up later in life, a scenario that you can then use your breath for and hopefully you'll remember like, oh, didn't that book say something about, um, yeah, an autoimmune disease? Well, such and such, my my father just got diagnosed with one, so now I what does it say? How can I help him? You know, um, so yeah, it's it's really exciting. Um, I I just feel like if anything, it's going to bring just so much more attention to people, just people realizing the power of their breath. Um, it's something that we do, it varies, you know, it's between 19 to 27,000 times a day is usually the range. And if you did anything else that many times a day, you'd probably have a pretty good idea of how and why you do it. But our breathing's kind of been swept under the rug a little bit as something that just happens. Yet, cultures that have been around for centuries have been using it for all sorts of different reasons and we've decided that it's not important. Well, as you've said in the last couple of years, people have realized, hey, there's something here. And you just need to experience it. That's the biggest thing. It's if you just try, be open to trying it out and yeah, once you once you experience it, then you know it.
Dr Rupy: Yeah. I can't wait for people to get their hands on the book, man. It sounds great.
Richie Bostock: Oh, thank you, mate. You know, it's I don't know what what your experience of writing a book is like, but I'm not very good at sitting in front of a computer and like typing stuff for long periods of time. And so it was a real exercise in discipline for me. You know, in school and university, I was one of those people that left everything to the last minute, any assignment or anything. And then do an all nighter to get it in. Um, so I had that tendency in me, I could see it of like, oh, I could procrastinate and do something else. Um, but, uh, it was I'm very very proud of the book. I'm very proud of myself, actually, for for for managing to do it. Yeah, I'm going to give myself credit. I'm very proud of myself. Uh, and I just hope it helps as many people as possible.
Dr Rupy: It's a great book, mate. And I'm sure it will. And, you know, on that note, I think we should, could I choose what kind of breathwork I need this afternoon?
Richie Bostock: Yes, of course. You just just let me know.
Dr Rupy: I think I need some focus. I've got some some, uh, some assignments to do, um, later on today that I need to figure out. So I know your your book is like a smorgasbord of different sort of breathwork techniques, but that one is definitely one that I think is quite interesting because I'm quite interested in productivity and all the other, you know, things that we were talking about earlier in terms of the projects. So, yeah.
Richie Bostock: And ironically, uh, probably the technique I used the most during writing the book was to sit down and focus. So what we, um, have been able to measure when like I have some basic biofeedback devices at home that can do basic EEG, basic HRV and these kinds of things. Um, even pulse oximetry and, um, you know, when when you couple a couple of different breathing styles together, it seems to be able to put you in the best, we call it like being in the zone, right? And what it looks like is combining an energizing style of breath that creates a mild stress response in the body because that's what energizing styles of breath do. Then combining that and ending that with a relaxing style of breath. So it's like you do one for a period of time and then you do the other one straight afterwards. So it might take you three to five minutes. Um, what I would like to, I can I have lots of different energizing breaths and relaxing style breaths in the book, but if we pick energizer bunny, which is a breath where you breathe three times in through the nose quite quickly and then sigh out through the mouth. It's called energizer bunny because when people do it for the first time and you're they're breathing quickly through their nose, they kind of like start to twitch their nose all around like a like a little bunny rabbit. So, um, it will sound something like this because you can't see it. So it goes, it's an old Sufi technique. So it's fast. And as a general principle, a faster style of breath is going to energize you. It's going to activate the sympathetic response mildly, get you ready to do something. And in the brain, what that will look like as well is moving the your brain waves into perhaps a, with something like this, maybe just mid-level beta brainwave, which is not stressed, but it's kind of you're active and you're you're about to do something. And, um, so you would do this breath for like 45 seconds or so. And we maybe we can do it together. Um, and then after that, you use a breath style to help you to relax. Now, if an energizing style is fast, then it makes sense that a relaxing style is slower. So we use the breath to slow everything down, um, and bring ourselves more into that parasympathetic state and in the brain, that would also look like bringing the brain waves, ultimately, if you did this for long enough into an alpha brainwave state, but after doing this, um, faster breathing technique first, it's really going to bring you more into a lower beta brainwave state, which is actually the best state for focus. Um, there's been the the study I mentioned in the book, which I'm forgetting the name of the person, the researcher now, but basically he took a bunch of, um, children with ADHD and then stimulated their brains for a lower brainwave state and their IQ went up 21 points. So it's fantastic for for getting in the zone. So, um, if we use energizer bunny and then let's use coherence breathing afterwards, which is the most simple thing you can do, breathing in and out through the nose, six seconds in, six seconds out, nice and slow. And that's it. So, I don't know, do you want to try it?
Dr Rupy: Yeah, let's try it.
Richie Bostock: Okay, cool. I'm going to, do you mind if I, uh, measure this on my aura ring?
Dr Rupy: Yes, of course.
Richie Bostock: Just as I'm fascinated by the insights I have when I meditate. So I'm going to, I'm going to record it and just see what what it.
Dr Rupy: I don't have my timer on me, so I can't even measure how long we're going for, but that's all right. We'll just.
Richie Bostock: That's all right. We'll just wing it. Play it by ear. So if you're joining us at home, doing these techniques, please make sure you're doing them in a safe environment. So you're not driving, not operating any machinery, you're not in water. Um, because particularly with the energizer bunny, you'll feel a bit buzzy and sometimes people feel a bit light-headed. Uh, and then obviously when we start to bring things down with coherence breathing, you might just kind of drift off a bit. So, um, please be in a safe place, sitting comfortably. So one more time, energizer bunny looks like this. It's three inhales through the nose, progressively filling up your lungs more and more. So by the time you get to the third breath, your lungs are more or less quite full. And then just sighing out through the mouth. And then coherence breathing, which we'll do afterwards, six seconds in, six seconds out through the nose. That's pretty straightforward. So I'll do it with you and then I'll guide you as we go. So I invite you now, you can even close your eyes if you like, get comfy wherever it is that you're seated. Exhale out through the nose and we will begin with our energizer bunny together. So, in, in, in, out. In, in, in, out. In, in, in, out. Nose, nose, nose, mouth. Nose, nose, nose, mouth. You got it. So, nose, nose, nose, mouth. Nose, nose, nose, mouth. In, in, in, out. And keep it going. So you have a pace and I just sped it up a little bit. So staying with that. And if you start to feel a bit spacey or light-headed, that's okay. You might even start to feel your body feel like it wants to move or your heart rate accelerate a little bit. That's because we're creating that mild sympathetic stimulation in the body. And we're just going to do it a few more times. So keep it going. Filling up the lungs with that third breath almost full. So it's not a short breath or a small breath. It's a quite a big breath, but quickly. All right, so just a couple more. Last one. Great. Now just take a nice long inhale through the nose all the way up and just sigh out through the mouth. Okay. So now we're going to move into our coherence breathing. So breathing in and out through the nose. I invite you to exhale out and then we're going to inhale for a count of six together in three, two, one and in two, three, four, five, six, out two, three, four, five, six. In through the nose, two, three, four, five, six, out through the nose, two, three, four, five, six. In two, three, four, five, six, out two, three, four, five, six. In two, three, four, five, six, out two, three, four, five, six. In two, three, four, five, six, out two, three, four, five, six. Now keep going yourself, you have the pace. And really, really paying attention to the length of your inhales and your exhales. So you really want to ration the breath so that you are inhaling for the entire six seconds in and exhaling for the entire six seconds out. It might feel a little bit challenging to do and that's okay. And that's actually part of the practice is learning to be so delicate and to be so gentle with the breath that you can extend it out for six seconds in, six seconds out. When you really start to practice more with this, you'll be able to go seven seconds, eight seconds, nine seconds, 10 seconds, 20 seconds. The longest exhale that I've managed to do was two minutes 14 seconds. So, one of my teachers, Dan Brule, his longest exhale was over four minutes. So, you can do some pretty cool things with the breath. And really, there is no limit. But we all start somewhere. So seeing if you can maintain that six seconds in, nice and slow, inhaling all the way. And even when you get to the top of your inhale, you shouldn't feel as though you have any straining or tension, like you're trying to overinflate your lungs. Still leave a little bit of space because you want the whole process to feel kind of relaxing. And if you're trying to breathe in as much as you can and exhale as much as you can, well, that can just put undue stress on the body. So see if you can find a comfortable range of inhalation and exhalation and just doing it nice and slow. And we'll just go for a little longer here. When you do this yourself, maybe 40 seconds or so, 40 seconds to a minute of energizer bunny, and then about three minutes of coherence breathing. And I don't know how long we've gone for, but I'm sure we're probably nearly there. So maybe just finishing the next breath you're on, exhaling out, and then just relaxing for a moment and just keep your eyes closed for a second and just see if anything feels different in the body. If there's any sensation, sensation, maybe your even your breathing feels a little bit different. Maybe it feels a little bit easier or a little bit more open or maybe your body just feels a bit more soft and relaxed. And when you feel ready, you can open your eyes and come back to the world of the senses. Sometimes it's the hardest thing to do to come back. You're like, no, I want to stay here. How do you feel?
Dr Rupy: Definitely a lot lighter. A lot, a lot lighter. Yeah. I think the, the energizer bit was, um, uh, challenging, but I don't think we went for that long and there was definitely light-headedness that made me feel a little bit uncomfortable, but the the breathwork at the end, um, was great. I loved the description that you made about, you know, it not feeling too stressful right at the end of the inhale. I felt like I could inhale even more.
Richie Bostock: And that's a good place to be.
Dr Rupy: Yeah, my my lungs felt almost like an elastic band, like, you know, and I was just pushing it very, very slightly, putting some tension on it and then the exhale was really nice and easy. So I feel like in my practice, I'm going to I'm going to experiment a bit more with that and maybe push the inhale and exhale slightly longer, maybe maybe by a second or two. But that, yeah, that's I'm definitely going to be doing a lot more of that kind of stuff, I think, during the day. I don't do it enough.
Richie Bostock: And how interesting is it, you know, when you mentioned, you know, you did the energizer bunny and it felt like kind of uncomfortable, right? So what a great, you know, um, what great evidence of how you're activating the systems to create that stress response. And that stress response can lead to feelings of anxiety or worry or panic and because it's the same thing that happens in the body when you go through an anxiety attack or a panic attack, you know, and and but it's all again, it's almost creating that you stress. Can you do these kinds of breathing techniques and just be completely relaxed in it and go, you know what, sure, I can feel these sensations coming up in my body, but I know them and I'm comfortable with them and they feel totally fine. And then something weird happens and you start to learn to enjoy them. And all of a sudden you're like, uh oh, is this a good thing? I don't know. Um, but yeah.
Dr Rupy: Well, I like that analogy with a lot of different things that we do to improve health. They sound quite counter-intuitive. So, you know, if you look at exercise as an example, you're literally shearing muscles and causing an inflammatory response, but the impact of your body's repair mechanisms is actually what leads to greater resilience, hypertrophy of the of the muscle and and better outcomes across the board, whether it be heart health, cognitive health. The same thing with food, you know, a lot of the plants are causing, uh, eliciting a mild inflammatory response, like turmeric, for example.
Richie Bostock: Really?
Dr Rupy: Yeah, so the the process is called hormesis, which is essentially where you elicit a mild, um, uh, inflammation response, a literal inflammation response, and it's the, uh, reaction of your body's natural antioxidant defense mechanisms, um, that actually leads to benefits in an overall anti-inflammatory effect. It's really interesting. It's sort of the basis behind why resveratrol might have cognitive and cardiac benefits, turmeric, again, is another thing that has hormetic effects. Um, a number of different dark green leafy vegetables, the brassica family, these actually induce, uh, effects that sound counter-intuitive, but it's the impact of that. And and to that point, you know, um, I'm just looking at my stats on my on my, uh, device, yeah, my aura ring, yeah. Uh, so my heart rate went all the way up, obviously, during the energizer, but then it's that that response afterwards and I can tell that my my heart rate came right down to like probably around 44 beats. So a good different.
Richie Bostock: Do you have the beginning resting heart rate on there as well?
Dr Rupy: So I didn't do, what I should have done is put it on right at the start and then left it for a minute and then done the practice. So I don't have my beginning resting heart rate, but I imagine my resting heart rate is usually around 46 to 48. It's fairly low. And then at night, it's like 45. Um, but yeah, that that went up to like 52 at the start and then it probably went up higher than that.
Richie Bostock: I feel like it went must have gone higher.
Dr Rupy: It must have gone higher than that. Yeah, because it's a stimulating breath. Exactly, yeah. It's, uh, the first couple of minutes, they they didn't register. So it definitely would have gone higher than that because I could feel my heart going and then the next time it registered was around 50, 56. So, yeah. But yeah, that was that was great, man. I'm definitely going to be doing that a lot more.
Richie Bostock: Oh, I'm gosh, I'm telling you, that one saved me during the book writing process. It was sit in front of a computer, okay, next four minutes, just do this breathing and it always just completely for me anyway, it always just resets, uh, how, it also an interesting way just resets how I feel about the work. It's a great and so you could use it even for procrastination as well. Um, you know, even for addictions, you know, when perhaps if you struggle with, you know, it could be smoking, it could be even food addictions. Um, you know, when we talk about the harder substances and stuff, that's perhaps a little bit different, but but quite often all you need actually is a moment to just break that pattern of addiction and breath is an incredible way to do that because it can shift your state rapidly. Um, you can, you know, if if you can you can create the energy if it's what you need to do to break it or you can you can relax deeper with it. Um, you know, sometimes what I do is if I feel like I'm hungry and there's a big difference between being hungry, hungry and emotionally hungry. And sometimes it's hard to tell the difference. Uh, when I was, I've done a few fasting exercises recently, like 72-hour fasts and stuff and you really learn a lot about yourself when you do those experiments. Um, but, you know, if a great way to tell if you're emotionally hungry or actually hungry, hungry is to just before you go to the pantry or reach for the fridge, just sit down and do some breathing for three minutes and even coherence breathing is by itself is great. And just see if that feeling of hunger passes in that three minutes. If it does, then actually you're okay, you don't need to. Um, you don't need to eat. It might be it's not the body craving nutrients and actually it's an emotional crutch. Um, so it's that's a useful thing to do.
Dr Rupy: I think it's a really good tool. Yeah, it's sort of, uh, one of the, um, practices of mindful eating is, you know, take a few breaths before rather than sitting in front of a computer screen and just scoffing away when you don't actually become intuitive or, you know, at one with how your body's feeling and how it's reacted to food. It's one of the reasons why I try and eat slow, although I need to work on that. And I'm pretty hungry right now, so I should probably.
Richie Bostock: I'm so hungry. Yeah. The room still smells like what you were cooking before. I'm very excited.
Dr Rupy: Yeah, we're going to be having a curry with, um, red kidney beans, um, some fried mushrooms and, uh, yeah, loads of spices. It's going to be so good.
Richie Bostock: So good. So excited. So excited. Cooked by the man himself.
Dr Rupy: Yeah.
Richie Bostock: Yeah.
